We Need to Be More Like Them

So your point is…racism exists in Europe? Umm…yup.

I suppose there are liberal cretins who think that there’s such a thing as “European” culture, although I can’t for the life of me think of a single cultural element that Ireland, Portugal and Denmark have in common.

Good thing nobody on the right would ever broad, general statements about “Europe”, eh?:wink:

Good job! Use the actions of a few soccer fans to develop an inaccurate generalization of European culture. How American of you!

It’s Lance, b. The great and almight Lance

Gordon (the self anointed magnificent),

Vinny’s post does make a generalization. Why you have trouble coming to terms with this? I don’t know. – (But then again, something about you screams low test scores)

Racism is prevalent in all societies and cultures. It doesn’t come as a shock to see Europeans coming to grips with the issue. Furthermore, it is a myth projected mainly by conservative pundits that liberals idolize Europe. Liberals don’t hold Europe to be the Paragon of social order and good government. Liberals posses the capacities to observe how a state deals with an issue while considering a new route in how we solve similar problems.

Perhaps you should come to the table with something a little more substantive than your often hollow and ill fated attempts at humor.

I don’t think that’s a generalization at all. I think most american liberals do believe that Europe is the model we should be following. From their socialized medicine to their general acceptance of all that comes out of the UN, to their general loathing of Israel, to their unbelievable taxes…

I’d say that those ideas pretty much characterize the american left. Care to prove me wrong?

Furthermore, it is a myth projected mainly by conservative pundits that liberals idolize Europe. Liberals don’t hold Europe to be the Paragon of social order and good government. Liberals posses the capacities to observe how a state deals with an issue while considering a new route in how we solve similar problems.

Typical liberal. Patrick gets his panties in a wad and accuses Vinny of “generalizing”, then proceeds to do the same himself.

The difference? Vinny actually cites specific examples to support his case while Patty just runs his cakehole.

That’s the best troll you got?

Weak.

Heh- does this really need to be articulated?

Remember the bombing of Kosovo? How about Bosnia? What about the squabbles between President Clinton and Boris Yelstin during the late 1990′s? Maybe it is the fact that Liberal Americans are quick to offer at times the harshest criticism to Putin’s Russia and Blaire’s Britain.

On issues like health care, many liberals have turned to Canada- not Europe- and seen a successfully operated government run health program.

Again, do you have anything of substance to ad to this conversation or are you going to continue with your half-wit remarks?

Relatively speaking- Ours is awful!

If ours is so bad why aren’t people streaming across the border for health care?

So why does the U.S. have such a problem with its citizens buying Canadian drugs on the black market?

Perhaps it is because Canadian officials have the balls to stand up to drug and insurance companies?

The word MOST eliminates the statement as a generalization. If he said “ALL Liberals…” – that’s a generalization.

The FDA prohibits more drugs than Canada’s government, yet it is Canada that shows balls against the drug companies? Someone buy Patrick some logic.

Better blame that big time conservative Ted Kennedy for helping write that one…

Those wascawy conservatives disguising themselves as democrats!

What is it with liberals and fighting big this and big that when your main weapon against it is big government?

Patrick- What would the benefit be for me to agree to universal health insurance? Who is going to pay for it? Those that already receive it as a benefit from their company and make the additional weekly payments toward the policy?Should I pay for the construction workers insurance? He or she wants the big paycheck every week, with a company that offers no insurance but doesn’t want to pay for private insurance?

good non answer balbulican:roll:

so you were just talking to talk. The statement you made really doesn’t pertain to anything that has been posted. I see

I can’t speak for al of Europe personally, but I can speak pretty knowledgeably about one little slice of Europe, namely Croatia. I was born there. (Yugoslavia at the time) I don’t have any memories of it back then because I came to America as a three year old. Thank God!!
However, I have been back several times, and I still have many family ties over there. My parents still live there for half the year. Everything that Vinny said in his post about Europe is basically true of Croatia. (Except for the snobbery of the French) Croatia is like most of Europe bursting with Anti-Semitism. The only Croatians who don’t seem to hold these Anti-Semitic views are people like my parents who spent a lot of their lives in the U.S. Croatia is also extremely anti- Bush and anti-republican in general. Their logic for these views is not clear and sometimes irrational. They call Pres. Bush a “cowboy”; they say that he stole the election in 2000, etc. They hold a great affection for Bill Clinton, mainly because he helped beat back their old nemesis the Serbs. Even though they have no love for the people of Kosovo and Muslims in general. Even their admiration of someone is based on hate for another. (Not that the Serbs didn’t sometimes deserve this scorn) Like most of Europe they speak loosely of American racism, failing like most in Europe to notice that we have the most diverse population in the world. Meanwhile the Croatians, Serbs, Bosnians, Montenegrins, etc. all basically look alike and speak the same language, yet they all despise each other, so go figure.
Europe should start looking inward instead of being preoccupied by what we Americans do and believe in. I’d refer them to the old biblical teaching about pointing out a splinter/speck in someone else’s eye when you don’t notice the log in your own eye.

I’m just saying that for all the lefties who think the US needs to be as tolerant as Europe, it’s time for them to take off their rose colored glasses.

Nice new look on the site, by the way. Very slick. Is that you on the bike?

And the coach?

Patrick,
Vinny’s post is anything but a sweeping generalization. Seems your making one about his post though, huh? What he did was cite a few specific instances to support his case. I recommend you do your homeowrk and learn about the rampant racism in Europe, a good place to for you start would be google. Let me know when you can bring anything to the table.

I’d say the statement…

“Most liberal americans would love us to be more like Europe.”

…is a bit of a generalization. Wouldn’t you?

I guess we mean different things by the word “generalization”. My definition is “a general proposition obtained by inference from particular cases”. Your statement fits that definition. I’m not sure what your definition is.

As for disproving your statement…not possible. It’s so broad as to be almost meaningless.

I doubt very much, for instance, that most American lefties think that the US should be adopting Hungary’s fiscal policy, Italy’s education policy, Ireland’s atrocious public works and transit systems, France’s attitude toward customer service, Poland’s public sanitation standards, and so on.

Can anyone point out a substantial conclusion made by Gordo? Something that wasn’t extrapolated from a conservative pundit’s rant?

BTW Patty – I’m patiently waiting for you to cite something to support your own “generalizations.”

Canada has a successful national health care system?

Well I guess if 14 days for bypass surgery is your idea of successful, then Canada rocks.

It is?

If ours is so bad why aren’t people streaming across the border for health care?

Ours is the best in the world. Everyone has coverage. If you can’t afford it, the government provides it for you (on a similar level to what the governments who provide it for everyone provides). If you can, you pick where you want to go.

Why don’t you ask the nice folks in England, of which I know many people how much they like their medical system. While you’re at it, ask them why the rich folks built private hospitals and won’t use the much ballyhooed public ones.

As for Canada, their wait times for surgery are ridiculous. Of course they make allowances for urgent surgery, but let’s not kid ourselves on who gets better care.

Our is the best. Theirs is the cheapest. Each has a place in the world.

Oh yeah. They have lots of balls. They stand up to those bastards.

Right after they buy the drugs.

Heh…and part of the reason the U.S. gov. refuses to buy into a universal health care plan is because of the potential damage it could do to drug and insurance companies. (an important part of the U.S. economy) Next we shall evaluate the recent drug bill passed by the conservative congress that many have scrutinized as a give away to drug companies. Oh yes- America has some backbone!

As liberal, I don’t have a problem criticising Democratic leadership. I am disgusted with the current tactic of the Democrats.

Who are these people that have so many problems with the healthcare system in America? I have yet to have a problem. My family and friends have yet to have a problem.

Vinny- The point you made about the Holocoust said it all. If something as horrific as that did not teach them about tolerance, and 60 years ago at that, then when can we expect it. For teams (coach included) to participate in this behaviour says something about the culture, or lack thereof of the people.

Just to maintain my cherished role of resident pedant: the question of which health system is “best” depend on what criteria you use to evaluate it. It’s like declaring Bush’s fiscal policy a success: you can always find something to praise, and if you ignore the deficit and the collapsing dollar, you can convince yourself of anything.

I can think of about twenty criteria I personally would use to evaluate a national health care system. How the US system scores against the Canadian system depends on how you weight the criteria.

Of course, if the criterion is “It’s the best because it’s OURS”, the discussion certainly becomes a whole lot easier.

I wasn’t talking to you, Pam, which is, perhaps, why you sensed a disconnect between your question and my response.

If your question was an actual request for information about the mechanics of a socialized health system, I’ll be happy to provide you with links that give you a good overview.

My comment was a response to Vinny’s posting, number 20. Sorry you missed it.