May 02 2005
Seeking Forgiveness
On Saturday, I made a promise to myself and to God that I would go to confession. After 15 years of not even going to church, the time had come to make an appearance in the confessional. I hadn’t missed mass in weeks, but I hadn’t been fully participating either (meaning I wasn’t receiving communion because I was in a state of sin).
I psyched myself up to going all week. If you’ve never been to confession, it’s very stressful. Oh sure, there’s a tremendous amount of relief when it’s all over, but the idea of going into the equivalent of a small box, kneeling, and baring your soul to anyone is a rough experience (unless of course you’re a liberal who believes that every minor heartache requires therapy).
I arrived at the Church, which since it was an hour before the Saturday mass, was almost empty. Two people were in the pews waiting for their chance, and I settled in a few rows over. The priest came down the aisle, went into the confessional and turned on the light. One by one, the people ahead of me went in. Then came my turn. I could delay it no longer.
I went in, and kneeled.
“Bless me father, for I have sinned. It’s been 15 years since my last confession.”
You could cut the air with a knife. I was so embarrassed. On one hand, here I was, baring my sould and proud of having gotten up the courage to do so. On the other hand, I was thoroughly embarrassed that it had been so long.
“I don’t even know where to begin, Father. It’s been so long.”
“Don’t worry about it. I’ll help you. Why don’t you just tell me where you think you’ve strayed and we can go from there.”
I poured out my heart. I went down a littany of sins, possible sins, probably non-sins, and so on. The priest said the absolution, then he told me that what I was doing was a great thing and that coming back to the church was wonderful.
“I’m trying…” I said.
He told me that trying is the operative word and applauded me for coming back after all that time. He told me he would pray for me and hoped I would keep up the good work. I promised I would, and went back to a pew to say my pennance. Two Our Fathers later, and I was on my way home, comforted by the knowledge that my soul had been cleansed and my sins forgiven.
I start walking home and halfway home, I have a horrible thought. I forgot two very big things!
6 years ago, I received communion at a friend’s wedding without having gone to mass recently or having had confession.
7 years ago, I payed for an abortion (not my child) for my then-girlfriend.
Two major sins.
I couldn’t get back to the church in time. I just walked home, realizing that Saturday was a washout.
I pondered my courses of action for a bit. I could receive communion on Sunday. I mean, I had been to confession.
But I hadn’t confessed those sins.
What to do?
I consulted a forum I belong to and the answer, while thorough, didn’t really help me in clearing my conscience. I still didn’t know what to do because I had forgotten, in confession, to say “For these and all the other sins of my life, I am truly sorry.” I decided not to receive communion on Sunday and go to Saint Patrick’s today, where they have confession during weekdays. I lined up, waited my turn, and stepped into the confessional.
“Bless me father, for I have sinned, it’s been 2 days since my last confession.”
I rattled off the straggling sins and a few others, and then the priest asked me:
“Did you come to me on Saturday?”
“No,” I said, “I went to my own church.”
“Oh. Because if you did, what I usually do for people who haven’t been around for awhile is I go through the Commandments and one by one we discuss each one to make sure we have everything covered.”
“Oh…” I said.
“But don’t worry. Let me explain something to you, son. By going to confession on Saturday, if you made an honest confession, the sacrament covers all of your sins. The only time you won’t be forgiven is if you willfully withold sins from confession. But, if in good faith you declare all your sins, you will be forgiven even if you think of a sin later on that you didn’t mention.”
“I see..” I said.
“And you know what? When you hear that nagging voice in the back of your head going ‘what about this? what about that?’ that’s the devil and you have my permission to tell him to go to hell.”
I couldn’t help it. I laughed. It was partially relief, but partially because it caught me off guard.
“Now, let’s make an act of contrition”
I did, he absolved me and I walked out feeling like I was walking on air. As I was walking out, I joined the mass already in progress. At one point during the mass, I took the chance to say my two Our Fathers, and then, for the first time in 15 years, I legitimately received communion at church.
You may think it’s corny, or whatever else, but I almost cried when I sat down. I finally, for the first time in what seems like an eternity, felt like I was in God’s good graces again.
There’s nothing like the feeling of all that weight coming right off your shoulders. Nothing at all.
If you’re Catholic and doubting, unsure, or even just a bit lost, go back to mass. Take a moment when it’s offered to go to confession. The feeling afterward is worth all the agony and stress you put yourself through before going.
May 2nd, 2005 at 3:48 pm
Thanks for your opinion, Sirrios. It’s always valued, important, and enjoyed.
May 2nd, 2005 at 4:50 pm
I found this extremely fascinating. I’ve never been Christian and the majority of Christians around here are various types of Mennonites. What you described is completely alien to me.
May 2nd, 2005 at 5:21 pm
Vinny, I am genuinely happy you feel relieved after this experience, but it is exactly what I find wrong with most organized religion. The guilt. Everything is predicated on guilt and that only the church has the ability to absolve you of that burden.
I have never had an explanation that I understood, even from my wife (a devout Catholic). Why is there the need to confess your sins? You know what you did. God knows what you did. What is accomplished by verbalizing them, many times to a complete stranger?
And the thought that God would say you are unworthy of accepting the sacrament because you have not confessed is mind boggling to me.
My only logical explanation is that the Church (of any denomination) has to have a way of getting between you and God, and guilt is a very powerful bind indeed.
Honestly, help me to understand. I’ll take links if you don’t want to get too detailed so I can educate myself.
Thanks.
May 2nd, 2005 at 5:45 pm
I was raised, and confirmed a Catholic, and I still consider myself one, even though I prefer to call myself a Christian, period. Vinny has recently written about his separation from Catholicism, then his return to it. I laud his honesty because this isn’t a subject that’s easy to speak about.
As for me, I have some fundamental issues with the Catholic Church that I haven’t been able to get around. Confession is one of my sticking points. The last time I went to confession is the last time someone was able to make me go. I don’t believe that I will ever see the inside of that booth again. Vinny is right, it is scary.
My view is that priests are people; some are good some are bad. I don’t feel comfortable confessing to another flawed human being. I don’t believe that priests, reverends, pastors, etc. have the power to forgive and absolve people for their sins. I am not criticizing Church doctrine. I don’t want, nor expect the church to change for me. I have great admiration for the late great Pope John Paul II. I think he was a great man and a great leader of the Church. However, I can’t see someone like Cardinal Law and/or some pedophilic priest forgiving me of my sins. I believe only God can forgive people.
May 2nd, 2005 at 6:22 pm
Mike:
Here’s an excellent piece on that very subject. Pretty much explains everything in a nice straightforward way.
May 2nd, 2005 at 8:21 pm
I have to admit that I do not agree with the Roman Catholic church on most religious topics, especially when it comes to confession and communion. I understand why some people find the sacrament of confession comforting and relieving (as it appears you did). I understand the need for forgiveness before receiving communion. But, even after going through four years of RC high school, and reading through the page you linked (thanks for that, by the by, though I definitively disagree with some of the “old-skool” teachings included in it), I do not fully understand why Romans feel that sufficient forgiveness can only come from another person. Confession is a very powerful thing (having availed myself of it a few times, mostly out of curiosity), but… mandating it for salvation… not so sure :).
Sorry about derailing this into a minirant… Back to my original point for putting up this comment: Congratulations on your return to the church, and the reaffirmation of your faith. Regardless of the spcifics of your faith, it is always nice to see someone rejuvinate it :).
May 2nd, 2005 at 11:57 pm
Is that what non-Catholics really think? That the priest is forgiving you your sins?
I guess we can chalk yet another one up to epidemic misunderstanding the Roman Catholic faith. Yep, and we pray to saints and believe Mary is a goddess too.
One can’t help but pity…
May 3rd, 2005 at 7:09 am
Besides offering a willing ear upon which you can vent, I honestly see no other purpose for confessing one’s sins to another person. That is, beyond having someone to talk with, and having someone to tell you that your sins are forgiven, I do not understand the point of confession. In retrospect, I probably should have used the word “through” instead of “from”, in the fourth sentence of my first paragraph, but the lack of understanding the middle-man is still there.
As for the two actions you referred to in sarcastic jest, I know (well, knew) many Romans who did just that - prayed to deceased saints to intercede for them with God. (Heck, my mother often spoke of such actions being commonplace within the Roman schools and churches she attended as a child/young adult, if not expected of the children/members.) Additionally, I used to date a Roman Catholic Mariast (that does not appear to be the right term, but essentially a person who was of the Roman Catholic faith [a convert, no less], who joined a subsect of the same which believed that Mary was slightly more than human, and had some sort of “in” with God). Of course, that particular belief is part of the reason I refer to her in the past tense… In short, there are bases for the supposedly false stereotypes to which you allude.
At any rate, methinks your efforts might better be served attempting to educate us dumb heathens (by the by, I am not actually, but as that page to which Vinny linked seems to demonstrate, the belief that if one is not Roman, one is not fully Christian, seems to still have sway within the church), rather than pulling the again-stereotypical Roman-superiority condescension that seems so “epidemic” amongst members of that faith, as evinced by your unnecessary, and uncalled-for “pity”.
And, damn, I am just going for the world’s record run-on sentence… I apologize to Vinny for apparently turning this into a slugfest… That was not my intention when first posting here. I guess we are just continuing to support Tim Graham’s postulate on Hell… I will try and keep my posts more topical in the future.
May 3rd, 2005 at 10:22 am
Chet,
Instead of coming in with the condescending attitude, why don’t you offer some answers or links as Vinny provided.
Here’s what I was taught as a child: You have the Holy Trinity: Father, Son and Holy Spirit. The Son returned home to the Father. The Holy Spirit was left on earth for humans to converse with the Father.
Why would I need a third-party intermediary when I have a direct link?
May 3rd, 2005 at 10:36 am
Because you aren’t seeking forgiveness from the Priest, you’re seeking it from the Church and God for which that Priest is a representative. You can converse with the God all you want, but the teaching of the Catholic church is that if you commit any number of mortal sins you must confess those sins and do penance.
Venial sins (profanity, etc) are perfectly forgiveable through daily prayer, however the church teaches that confessing those in Reconciliation are a pious practice.
Something from Romans 10:10:
Speaking your sins is part of seeking salvation in the Lord. That’s the way I was taught it before I made my first penance in second grade.
(I know that quote talks about the raising of Christ from the dead, however the concept still holds; confessing with your mouth is a more sacred method than with the heart alone)
May 3rd, 2005 at 4:11 pm
It wasn’t my intention to be condescending, Mike. I apologize. It’s just natural for me to feel pity for those who condemn others out of ignorance. Especially of late, Roman Catholics seem to be a great target of such ignorant condemnation.
The funny thing about Faith is that for the true believer its concepts are simple. For the skeptics they are complicated. And for those who have “fallen from grace” they are next to impossible to comprehend.
Perhaps the most comprehensive source for Roman Catholic concepts on the web is New Advent. I’d start there.
Regarding the Holy Trinity, the Holy Spirit, in particular: The Holy Spirit is both a third “person” and the same being as God. The Holy Spirit was left to live within each of us - our conscience, to understate it. In other words, God is inside everyone.
The intercession and invocation of saints, angels and the Blessed Virgin Mary in Heaven: It was revealed that those in heaven hear our petitions (the little eavesdroppers, they are). They continue to pray to God. By invoking them, we worship the Lord by recognizing those who lived and breathed in His service and we make our prayers all the more powerful in this humility. Domine, Non Sum Dignus “Lord, I am not worthy… But only say the word and I shall be healed.”
May 3rd, 2005 at 6:22 pm
I do not honestly recall “condemning” anyone, and looking back on my posts, I do not see any real indication of that. I was merely expressing a difference of opinions with a sect of Christianity, and a general misunderstanding. I am sorry if those statements were somehow misinterpreted. However, it would not be that large of a stretch of imagination for one to see Person A referring to Person B as someone who has “fallen from grace” solely because Person B is not Roman Catholic as a condemnation, all things considered. Or, at the very least, a continued symptom of the overall hubris.
As for the topic, I tend to believe more towards The Other Mike S’s comments, in that I generally go straight to the source, rather than relying on middlemen. I guess, since I was not raised in a Roman Catholic household, I will never fully grasp the majority of its doctrines/dogmas. I mean, I fully understand that confessing aloud is a powerful thing, but I do not understand why it necessarily has to be to another person, or even why that confession to another person is absolutely mandatory for communion. Speaking one’s thoughts aloud (regardless of their topic) is a way of bringing things out into the open, forcing one to both seriously consider them, and bring them to the forefront of your life - it is far too easy to casually dismiss thoughts, but words, once spoken, have a powerful weight. Dunno… I guess it is just going to be one of those “agree to disagree situations” :).
As for those currently lounging about in God’s lap, where was that belief revealed, and by whom? (To alleviate possible misunderstandings, yes, that was a serious question, and was not meant as rabblerousing.)
May 3rd, 2005 at 6:37 pm
Folks:
Confession, from a non-practicing Catholic is silly when you come down to it.
This business of speaking to God through priests is like so much mombo jumbo. The concept iis brilliant when you think about it fron the providers angle. Religion in this day and age is for the weak. To many so called Christians don’t behave like Christians. Look at the gay issue. I like the idea of the Mormans spaceship personally.
Dick
May 3rd, 2005 at 7:23 pm
Hey Linoge… This might be what you’re looking for. It addresses that question from a few different angles.
I skimmed through it and it seems to cover all the bases.
May 3rd, 2005 at 7:25 pm
Chet,
As Linoge points out, there has been nothing even approaching condemnation. I originally asked a question about confession. I and others have questioned and disagreed with various RC practices, but condemn? Not even close.
The funny thing about Faith is that for the true believer its concepts are simple.
Where has questioning faith entered into this discussion? I have questioned a specific practice, not Vinny’s or anyone else’s faith. Blind obedience and blind faith can be two very different things.
May 3rd, 2005 at 7:31 pm
Come on guys, let’s play nice. This is actually an interesting discussion
It’s always interesting to see people on the outside and how they perceive your faith. I’m loving every minute of this.
Oh sure, I can’t answer every question, but that’s part of religion and that’s why we have Bibles and churches!
May 3rd, 2005 at 8:11 pm
:grin:Hi. I quit the whole religion thing almost 30 years ago and went straight to God our Father. Yes, I simply talk to Him every day, if I sin, I go to Him and confess, yes, He is a consuming Fire, but I have also found that He is My Lover and Comforter and Friend and He forgives when you are honest and make Him Lord of your life. It solves a lot of those problems. Take Him with you through life and never suffer from guilt or those types of problems again. He is Love, and you love Him so much, that you WANT to obey and please Him. Simply ask Jesus to be Lord, and then you have direct access to the Father. Period. No hail Marys, or other things. Just life with Him as your friend, guide and Lover. Kathie
May 3rd, 2005 at 8:18 pm
Good luck to you. However, what you’re doing is a direct contradiction to the Commandment to “keep holy the Sabbath.”
More power to you if that works for you, but I wouldn’t advise that for anyone.
May 3rd, 2005 at 10:59 pm
Ah, thank you Vinny. That link did clarify things for me, and really will have to boil down to an “agree to disagree” situation… The Roman Catholic church (and thus its members) and I do not interpret those Bible verses in the same fashion. And when the difference of opinions simplifies that far, there cannot be much, if any, reconciliation.
At any rate, I am going to go ahead and assume that you realize “keep holy the Sabbath day” does not necessarily mean “go to a building and kneel for an hour every Sunday”….
May 3rd, 2005 at 11:17 pm
Actually in the Catholic Church it does…
And we don’t kneel for the whole hour
May 4th, 2005 at 1:03 am
I’m going to have to go with AWolf on this. With all respect, it just sounds cult-ish.
So here’s a scenerio: a serial killer, still on the loose, finds God and confesses his sins in church. Before being caught, he dies of a heart attack.
Does he go to heaven?
I can see the difference religion makes in people’s lives right here, but they are all still cults in my mind. And I certainly don’t need any pity for this belief.
May 4th, 2005 at 2:09 am
If pointing out the “wrong” one sees with organized religion is not condemnation of the organized religion on discussion here, can someone tell me what is?
My statement about the concepts of Faith and the ease versus difficulty of understanding them wasn’t accusing anyone of questioning someone else’s faith. I was pointing out that concepts of different religions are harder to comprehend the farther separated you are from belief in them.
And bsti, with all due respect, this cult label is really getting old. For the nth time, you need to look up the definition and see how silly your accusation is.
Regarding the scenario you point out, the forgiveness of sins all depends on intention and repentance. If the killer was truly repentant, he would not only have confessed to the Church, but also to the authorities to accept his punishment under man’s law. What’s in your heart is what matters to the Lord. There aren’t any loopholes to exploit.
May 4th, 2005 at 11:30 am
Chet, discussion, disagreement or questioning are not the same as condemnation.
Your attitude is like someone who pulls out the Race Card or Sex Card or whatever Politically Correct device they need to turn off the spigot of discussion or dissent towards their cause. You’re using the Religion Card. I’d suggest using education as opposed to sensationalism.
For the record, I sent both of my boys through Catholic elementary school and my wife teaches at a Catholic school. My oldest has embraced Catholicism and will be having his Confirmation in a couple of weeks (my youngest is an Orthodox Heathen like his old man - j/k!). Personally, in the grand scheme of things, I believe organized religion helps more than it hurts. It depends on the person and their circumstances.
It was interesting. My oldest just had to have the interview before the Confirmation. The priest asked if he was being forced to do this (being his mom was a teacher at the school). He right out and stated that neither of his parents forced this on him, it was a personal choice. If you knew my son, you’d know that when he said that, he said it with conviction.
We’ve raised our boys to be their “own man”. Question everything. Take nothing at face value. Understand the difference between faith and obedience. He’s going to be a great Catholic.
The church would be much stronger if they encouraged discussion about their practices. Sure, some would leave as a result, but those that remain would be rock-solid. They wouldn’t attend because of a sense of guilt but because of a sense of joy.
May 4th, 2005 at 1:47 pm
Mike - It’s very encouraging that despite your reservations you allow your children the freedom to follow their own spiritual path. It’s been my experience that the church isn’t quite as monolithic as many believe in terms of their judgementality. Even within a single dioscese you’ll find parishes that differ in their styles and interpretation of how to treat the sinful.
The parish I attend tends to use less guilt and more encouragement and understanding instead, than some of the other parishes in the area. We are also one of the the largest parishes in Arizona. It’s easy to draw a correlation.
Perhaps I was being too literal.
You said:
According to Merriam-Webster, though mild, your declaration that most organized religion is wrong is a form of condemnation.
, from com- + damnare to condemn — more at DAMN
1 : to declare to be reprehensible, wrong, or evil usually after weighing evidence and without reservation
I don’t mind the questions. It’s the judgement I’d rather do without.
The Lord is my judge. And I am joyful to worship Him. This also means that I am glad that I feel a bit of guilt and remorse whenever I step away from His light.
May 4th, 2005 at 5:42 pm
I am going to have to, once again, agree with “The Other Mike S”, even after reading through your definition. (Almost completely agree with him, at that… Stop stealing my ideas!) So far as I can tell, neither he nor I have condemned any religion, or any practicer of any religion. Yes, “The Other Mike S” did make use of the word “wrong”, however, I do not feel he was using it in such a drastic, accusatory, and generally attacking-ish tone as you seem to believe. Nor have my questioning of the Roman Catholic church’s belief structures been offensive, at least as far as I can tell… Rather, I have simply been expressing my own opinions on the matter, and how they are inconsistant with the Roman opinions. If you yank the montypythonv(”Help, I’m being repressed!”); card every time a simple difference of opinions arises…. *twitches*. To badly quote Shakespeare, “Methinks he dost protest too much.” Or, to put it simply (and perform a beautiful rendition of a backseat shrink), you appear to be jumping at ghosts out of insecurity. But just as you seem to have misinterpreted other people’s comments, I may be misinterpreting yours.
As for your statements about Faith and distance therefrom, consider these two sentences:
And….
I agree wholeheartedly with the latter comment. However, the former would be almost downright offensive to someone, if they were so inclined. In fact, your entire dialogue seems to be coming from the position that the Roman Catholics not only have a monopoly on Christianity, but that they are the only “right” version, and that any followers of any other sects have “fallen from grace”. This might be true if those followers were once Roman, if they subsequently left the Roman church, and if the Roman church was the only source of grace… However, the latter is definitively not true (even without considering the possible falacies of the first two clauses), and thus the entire comment falls flat on its proverbial face.
*shrugs* If I really wanted to “condemn” the Roman Catholic church, there are more than a few things contained within its past that would make far better fodder than a simple difference of opinions over confession. Or, I could go after something a little closer to home: The Roman Catholic church’s (and its members’) hubris, blind faith, and attempts to monopolize Christianity… But you do not see me doing that. In a similar vein, I would appreciate a certain amount of… forethought before making assumptions about other people’s faith, relationship with God, and the like. Just a thought.
May 4th, 2005 at 8:57 pm
For someone expressing discontent at another’s apparent proclivity for making reactionary assumptions you seem to feel quite comfortable assuming things without forethought, yourself.
From Mike’s confusion at the comprehension-of-concepts-of-Faith statement, I gathered that the message might not have come out as intended - hence the clarification.
The topic of this thread is Roman Catholicism and the meaning of confession in that Faith. A few of the commenters made some statements and asked questions that indicated some lack of understanding of concepts within Roman Catholicism. If you took my (albeit, layman’s) explanations of those concepts which a few of you didn’t understand as declarations that all other forms of Christianity can not be correct, you sadly missed the point entirely.
As far as playing the victim card is concerned, rest assured, no such card was played here by me. The comment about condemnation was just an observation that many of the assumptions that those who criticize the Church make are sorely misguided due to a lack of understanding of what these concepts mean and why they are in place.
Let’s not get caught up in this pointless game of back-and-forth accusation when, as Vinny said, we were having such a good discussion on religion.